So last night I came home from a long day of coding and my roommate drunkenly inquired about what I actually DO at work.

What ensued was an hour long explanation of what the internet was and how it worked, and how my code plays into it.

Needless to say, his mind was blown. But it made me realize
a) how much I know about the internet that most people don't.
b) how much I DON'T know! And I'm supposed to be one of the people who really understands this shit!

Blew me away when I realized how much goes on over the Interwebz without 99.99% of people really understanding what is going on.

Discuss/refute/agree/dgaf?

Are we discussing your lack of internet knowledge, or that people in general don't know how the internet works?

Both. I have a god damn CS degree for pete's sakes. Shouldn't I have learned how this shit works non-tangentially? Like directly?

Having a CS degree doesn't mean you know all the sociology and history involved, though. The internet is big and getting older. Trying to keep track of everything that goes on is going to be tough.

On that subject, this is one of my favorite videos about the internet (more about YouTube, but not the site itself, what people do with it).

Or do you mean specifically how the technical bits work?

Because that's easy:

Normal cats go in one side, and LOL cats come out the other side.

You're welcome.

^^This man. This man right here. Someone give him a goddamn pulitzer.

I saw a talk once where some older gentleman proposed "code or be coded" or something to that effect. (Tal may have been there too).

Is our reliance on a technology we don't fully understand bad? Inevitable?

Can you take apart your refrigerator? Your car? Your television? Does that matter?

Don't have the last two. But no. However, I do know how they work at a high level. I guess it doesn't really matter... If everyone had the same exhaustive knowledge of the internet, I wouldn't have a job XD. I guess what's awesome about humanity is that NOBODY knows how everything works, and it doesn't matter!

Dude refrigerators and piston engines are SUPER interesting. dem thermodynamics.

Also, this was why lakshmi's random lecture on the internet was so good, because nobody in the class knew how it worked, so you're certainly not alone.

I agree that most people don't know how any of their technology works, it's basically sorcery, and what's worse is that it's not intuitive so nobody can just divine how a CRT works without knowing a lot of science. Whether that's a right or wrong is based perspective though I guess; I think utilitarians aren't wrong in this situation.

tl;dr there is no internet aledwynne.files.wordpress.com

"Normal cats go in one side, and LOL cats come out the other side."

Hahaha! Apt description of the internet.

@geoff Agreed, but do we spend as much time with our refrigerator or our car as we do on the web (think about mobile web + email, too). And usually, people have some general idea about how a car works (motors and oil and things, right?), but people see the internet is seen as a mysterious ether.

Well I'm sure when cars were only 20 years old all the people with horse drawn carriages were probably looking at them like they were magic.

"What is this.... roundish.. thing? A *wheel*, you say?"

"Sorcery!"

I'm with Hursh on this one. Someone who uses a truck 8 hours a day better damn well know at least how to change the oil, what a transmission is, and how many cylinders are in their engine. Even if you don't, you'll learn soon enough when your shit breaks down.

I know people who use the computer/internet at work 8 hours a day (let alone on their freetime/phones) who have asked me for help because I "know computers".
Them: "This page won't load"
Me: "Hmm what browser are you using?"
Them: "Um... it's a Mac?"
Me: "(~_~;)"

What engine is in your car?
"Umm...it's a red car?"

That's exactly the right question to ask when developing products/services for the interwebs! Most of the products fail because the founders/developers are too deep into the subject.

Yes it's very easy to get caught in a niche echochamber in these sort of situations.

Regardless, more and more of the general population is becoming tech-literate. At the same time, technology is making it more and more feasible to have NO IDEA how your things work.

Problem? Awesome? Neither?

I suppose it's arbitrary. But it sure does amaze/scare me sometimes.

We don't know how things work because we don't have to know how they work. Some of us, if we needed to know, would learn - doesn't that free us up to do more awesome things.

For instance, when I started my first blog I coded it myself and then added Blogger to my self-hosted site (a practice that Blogger no longer supports.) It was always a little hinky. However, now that I use WordPress, I don't NEED to do my own HTML. And I can use premade templates that look pretty (and are not hinky). Now I can focus on *Ahem* "Content."

I don't know if the general population is becoming more technology literate - I think they're forced into technology and therefore have to 'learn' it but only do the bare minimum. I mean, I ask my friends about the Internet, they don't even understand the concept that there's actually a computer (or MASSIVE amounts of computers) sitting in a room somewhere to serve up the internet. Heck, they don't even understand the concept that you need to actually have an internet connection to even GO to Facebook.

While I would love if everyone took the time to understand how the internet works, I'm more concerned with their ability to navigate it. We're the exception, but for most people the internet is just a tool to get a task done. Many people don't need to know how their tool was built or how it works, they just need it to work.

That being said, their ability to navigate is important. Teaching friends and family how not to get spyware is crucial to my sanity :)

I'm not that savvy from a technical perspective, but I did use the interwebz to propose to my fiance. My better half is a huge nerd and she truly appreciated the style.

@Len interested to hear what you have to say about this- really like your piece here wwtid.com

In the future, when more and more technology is integrated in our lives, practically nobody will know how it works, right?

Ever read the series "the tripods"? It's some old science fiction but humanity forgets how to use technology because of alien overlords, and a group of rebels re-discover electricity, computers etc. Kinda fascinating.

As far as the meme- awesome. I guess it brings up the fact that knowing how to *use* the internet is very different from knowing *how the internet works*.

@andrew I haven't read that. Frankly I haven't read fiction in a while. Tools like this (Branch) among others like Twitter have really destroyed my ability to sit still and not be connected to the internet. It's pretty awful.

@Andrew - Totally agree. It's like knowing how to program versus knowing how the computer is build. Radically different in that scenario as well. From a career perspective, I think that knowing how to creatively use the internet can often be more lucrative than understanding and teaching the mechanics of it.

I agree with @lannalee that having more powerful but easier to use tools can free up creative minds to focus on building new and interesting things. I also think that a big part of the reason people don't know how the internet works (or that they are even using the internet) is because of how seamless it has become. We used to to have to dial up to get on the net... now thanks to wifi, broadband and cellular internet access... as soon as you turn on your phone or laptop your computer is on the net. You don't need to know where that information on your screen is coming from... it is just there.

Scott (@smencer) - OMG Dial up! Remember when you had to open a webpage and walk away from the computer to wait for any .jpg's or .gif's to load. Don't miss those days.

My only concern is that with people know less about the under-structure of how technology works, we will have less people who try to mess with it, to break things, to take risks and try something new.

It's a tall order to 'get' the interwebz. Anthropologies of users, history of R&D labs and RFCs that get our traffic from A to B. There's the physicality of fiber networks wrapped around the world and communities that depend of a jerry-rigged satellite connections for a small connection to the digital world. There's the design of it all: interactivity, accessibility, and localization.

A bit of understanding and a lot of wonderment goes a long way - but just knowing you should care about it is a huge step. Maybe the important part is getting people to see the internet as a miraculous bit of technology, and avoiding lessons on packet switching, SSH, and the intricacies of Perl.

Channeling @Geoff and @Lanna here, cheers guys.

Ah, right, one other thing! People can appreciate their fridges without understanding how electrical infrastructures work. Likewise, they can appreciate a car without knowing how crude eventually ends up in their engines. A macro understanding of these things on a basic level can be fun, but in the end I'd rather people know not to leave the freezer open - or how to indicate at a turn - than that 'higher order' stuff.

So another thought: Should you know how to butcher a cow if you are going to be eating burgers regularly?

Should you know how to milk a cow, or clean a fish, or grow vegetables in a garden?

Ha great point Zack- I guess being able to properly use technology is much more important than understanding how it works exactly. For us who *are* intrigued and want to know more, there's a whole INTERNET FOR US TO LEARN ON.

Let's also assume that the "singularity" does happen in our lifetimes. Understanding the mechanics of the interwebz isn't going to just mean deciphering 0s and 1s or how to assemble a server farm. It will lead into biology (specifically neuroscience).
-Computer to brain interfaces.
-Digital telepathy.
-Download and uploading of data from digital to organic storage.

@andruflockhart - That is the key: access to the tools to tinker for those who want it.
To bring it back to the car analogy: I can drive my car every day and have little to no knowledge of how it works. As cars become more complex, the driving experience becomes more reliable and more refined. I get a better and more reliable end user experience.
This is a great and wonderful unless I'm stuck with a car that can ONLY be maintained at the dealer with expensive tools and diagnostic equipment.
I'm not saying I want to rebuild my transmission... but I want the documentation to be available for me (or my mechanic). That way, I'm not at the mercy of the dealer (or just screwed if the dealer leaves/goes out of business).

@Geoff I think knowing even a little bit about those things can enhance the experience of eating a hamburger. Jump to 8:05 in this Radiolab segment radiolab.org

@Len If the Singularity does happen, those things will be increasingly important. But two things...
Would the singularity change the value of brain-stored knowledge and learning since everything is easily accessible?
Just because the singularity would shift or supersede traditional biology, does that mean more people would care about it than they do now?

@Scott I'm right there with you on that. Knowledge is power, and being left outside of some blackboxed tech. can leave you powerless. Hopefully the maker/hacker movement gains ground on simplicity and refinement.

@Scott Mencer - yeah that's a great analogy. I love the idea of open source and the freedom it offers *but* like many of us I'll admit I use the equivalent of "a car that can ONLY be maintained at the dealer with expensive tools and diagnostic equipment." Namely, a very nice macbook air.

I like this direction to the conversation- extrapolating on what we see now into the future (short of "the singularity") or what have you- will it be possible to maintain and understand your computer by yourself when it's even more complex, when its *part* of your body?? Branching this topic to the right >>

Please chime in or ask to join if you're interested.

Remaining in this vein,

A) I really like the points made about open source- but the percentage of people who use open source technologies for their daily work/life is excruciatingly minute compared to those that don't even know what open source is. Is that changing? I don't really have a handle on it- are more and more people using/learning opensource? Or is the percentage of total users who are groking linux decreasing?

B) As we find ourselves more and more engrossed in technology, what responsibility do we have to increase the educational efforts around it? Personally I think that every high school should require an introduction to the internet and coding. Perhaps I'm a bit biased by the crowd I hang with :)

Maybe the open source percentage is staying the same, accounting for the global increase in users. The Android community might tie in, but that's just 'more' open, very relative.

Using open source because it's free is also very different from participating in the community that develops, fully appreciates its openness. Is that a question worth asking?

I think that outright coding might be taking it too far, but a bit of introductory computer science logic mixed into math courses could be great. Basic internet understanding could/should be a part of introductory library science and research skills.

Everyone should also get an introduction to design and aesthetic as part of art class as well, though.

I've struggled with explaining to my family/friends what I do for my entire career. I've long given up and explain the outcomes, rather than the process. It's even more complex when I'm explaining to a client what I do, mostly because they project what they want on to what I do (and there's usually a gap).

As someone who has gone from being a "webmaster", freelance website design/developer and now front end developer, I think the idea of "knowing the interwebz" is becoming more difficult.

The Internet has gone from a state where if you knew a few HTML tags, you could make the webz. Now you can specialise in social marketing, database management, icon design or any number of specific areas.

I still think it's valuable to understand how it all ties together, but as the web grows its exciting that there are so many ways to find what you love and contribute.