My good friend Chuck Giroux and I met at Boston University while producing a TV show called "On That Point" that won a Telly Award for its focus on intelligent discussion of political issues.

I am a moderate liberal, and Chuck is a moderate conservative, and although we disagree on a lot of things, we share a common belief that using empiricism and reason, rather than emotion and ideology, can drive political and policy discussions. As a result, we can discuss politics and remain friends.

We'll be using this Branch to discuss the second presidential debate live on Tuesday, and we're also getting a head start today to chat about the previous presidential and vice presidential debate.

Send comments to @erparty, our joint twitter account.

I am really looking forward to discussing the debate tomorrow. It will be interesting to see if Obama can come back from his perceived poor debate performance 2 weeks ago. That said I wish both men would give me something that was concrete. Mitt Romney's budget and tax plan take "voodoo economics" to a whole new level and the president continues to simply run on the fact that he is not Romney instead of any meaningful plan.

Likewise! After the first debate, we got a chance to catch up and both agreed that Obama got shellacked, but that Romney didn't offer a ton of specifics.

We haven't been able to talk about it yet, so, what did you think of the VP debate?

In terms of the horse race, I thought Biden marginally "won" the debate. He seemed to have more specifics, especially on foreign policy, and he appeared more confident than Ryan. He called out distortions but still managed to be largely positive and jovial. I thought the Ryan-Raddatz exchange re: specific loopholes war particularly damaging.

That said, I thought the smiling teetered ever so close to condescending. It was okay because we all know Biden is a tad crazy, but it won't work for Obama.

I didn't watch because this is what the Vice President really deals with on a daily basis. youtube.com

Haha, fair, although for Joe Biden it seems to be more of this: joebideneatsicecream.tumblr.com

Oh Uncle Joe. But seriously Paul Ryan has been a bummer for me. I think he is kinda a nut but at least i thought he had some numbers to back up his plans instead of just the same old trust me this will work nonsense.

I feel like he probably did until he was selected, and now he's had to water down everything (now that reminds me of Veep). I remember watching a budget video with him in 2011 with graphs and numbers and animations where he almost had me believing that you could solve every problem just by cutting everyone's taxes.

Picking up from yesterday, Chuck, any predictions for tonight? Also, what do we make of the controversy over Candy Crowley?

Which controversy are you referring to. As for tonight's debate, were definitely going to see a more aggressive Obama that said I have little excitement over the town hall format.

The whole "is Candy Crowley going to actually moderate the debate?" controversy. I think it's emblematic of our political system that both parties have essentially secretly colluded to try to prevent a journalist from asking questions during a debate. The kind of thing you and I both think is absurd for a political party in 2012.

politico.com

I think the rules in these debates have become absurd. I hope she sticks to her guns and pulls a will mcivoy tonight.

Also what is with this 9pm start. Some of us got to go to work in the morning.

Somewhere in California, someone is groaning about how the 6pm start time interrupts dinner.

Also, note for those watching at home: despite the reference, Chuck and I share a deep belief that The Newsroom is not very good. At least, I think we do?

No it is not. Both on a general level but also as a person who has worked in television.

Offline, Chuck and I are discussing another shared interest: Prime Minister's Questions, a tradition we wish we had here in the US.

There on C-SPAN and all over youtube. Cant really describe it you just need to see it because its great.

This is where i will be watching.
youtube.com
They just showed Bill Clinton doing what he does best looking the questioner right in the face and making it personal. I am not expecting to see much of that tonight.

On the technical front, Anyone having issues with the youtube live stream?

Programming note: I think we're going to keep this between the two of us, but you can tweet at either of us via our joint Twitter account @erparty, which we'll be watching throughout and potentially responding here in the Branch.

Interesting new hashtag tonight #ObamaDebateTips

While were waiting for the debate to start anyone else think its weird that freemasons have to by recruitment ads?

Also were both watching on PBS. Gabe and I have had enough of wolf blitzer and his graphics.

Lets see about concise and on point

Here we go. I think Obama definitely won the handshake, making up for Romney's winning the coin toss.

No Comment.

Also asked by me a 1yr out college grad who has yet to find full time work.

It would be nice if you would tell me Mr. Romney what you know will help.

I had the same reaction. "I will create jobs" isn't really that reassuring or specific. And boom, Obama rolls out "let detroit go bankrupt already." But he doesn't criticize Romney for not being specific.

But also, Manufacturing Jobs for college grads? The numbers dont really add up to make that a viable proposition.

It's true. But "manufacturing jobs" plays well in Ohio. And Crowley has let herself out of the box early! Unfortunately, it's kind of a softball.

This is in accurate point though about the Auto Baliout. Both Companies did go bankrupt.

And Romney rolls out "12 million in four years," a plan that was totally debunked in today's WaPo.

washingtonpost.com

What an Accent.

Our mutual friend @pauljsquire, also of Long Island, might have something to say about that. He also adds on Twitter that the Romney jobs answer was not reassuring...but it was an answer.

Sorry, my mistake: Paul was referring to the Romney answer.

Gah, Paul says the Obama answer not reassuring, but an answer. This whole watching and writing thing is hard!

The president's work on clean energy and jobs has not been going well. A123 systems, a battery company for cars, went bankrupt today. Received a good deal of federal support.

That still really isnt an answer to the question. Mr President

Oh boy, pulling out the coal for the rust belt crowd

But seriously, Coal is bad there are better things like gas that we can use instead.

Weird camera angles STRIKE AGAIN

Woh, Romney and Obama going at it. They are the same height, which is awkward.

This is starting to look like PMQ's

That price is untenable. it was 1.86 because the sky was falling. Ill never forget when i got off a plane from london and saw that price.

Gabe, Whats your thoughts on the electoral college? I am sick of Iowa determining the future of the nation.

Get rid of it, the country has changed in the last 250 years.

I would love to see the tax code simplified. But i don't think either candidate would have the political capital to do it.

Here Here on the Electoral College being scrapped

Well what's really...not that interesting about this whole thing is that, and I don't remember the exact stat here, but when it comes right down to it, the difference between these two guys' tax plans is pretty small. Way less than 10% in terms of average net tax rate. The distribution is also pretty slightly different.

Could you imagine this getting through congress?history.com

Do you have that article about the tax plans?

It is true about the rates for small business? They are punishing and it forces business owners to look for all kinds of shanangians on the deductions front.

I'm looking for the article and failing to find it. Remind me after the debates. But by and large the difference is small.

As for rates for small business, mosto of what I've read says most small businesses won't be effected. But some will.

Also, snap, Obama finally trots out the numbers on Romney's tax plan. The liberal in me is very happy right now.

Another thing to consider, and its something that i am really thinking about. Is who can better deliver on their platform. Romney is an unknown but no one can say that Obama has done a great job getting things done.

I suggest this Washington Post article on how and why each candidate are going to get what done: nymag.com

Side note: did Romney just say "binder full of women"?

yes yes he did. You dont have one of those?

I do but I thought he agreed to keep that secret at last month's man meeting?

Of course they do.

God Planned Parenthood. I regret the day with this minor issue came to dominate public discourse.

Boom, We actually find out what Romney has thought about this stuff the whole time.

Sidenote: a disturbing number of my posts have 666 characters remaining.

You and Romney are both not wedge issue Republicans. Unfortunately, Romney had to run for office with tea partiers in mind, and he didn't exactly stick to his guns on that.

Putting on my Glen Beck hat, regarding 666: Ronald (6 letters) Wilson (6 letters) Reagan (6 letters). COINCIDENCE?!?!

Whose promises are actually going to be implemented. Thats my question.

"Is it Lorainne" Hey how you doing. Mitt is a real person. Don't forget. I wont blame you though if you do forget.

Illegal Immigration is way down thanks to economy. South park talked about it.

Yeah, and Obama uses the immigration down as a political point. Good catch.

Gabe, Would being a cameraman in this debate be a bad job or the worst job also.

Hows your pension? I bet its invested in Chinese seal murderers

Our friend @pauljsquire notes that Obama has gone well over his time on this last question, with no Candy crackdown. Just saw a tweet that Obama has gotten about 5 minutes more speaking time so far in this debate than Romney. Part of it is definitely when Romney asked Obama a question directly and ceded his time to it.

Being a cameraman in this debate would be a nightmare. Also imagine directing it? Yikes.

Obama is 3 minutes ahead in talk time.

I think that National Security is really a place where the president has shined.

Romney, you cant make Obama being weak on security stick. Just dont try.

Looks like he's trying to. You're right though, even during the first debate Obama was relatively strong on FP. Biden was even better last night.

Er, obviously not last night...last debate.

Jeez, yep its happening.

Lots of emotion in the last response from Obama. And it was strong. And Candy calls him out. Damn. Queue the bellyaching.

And there it goes blowing up on the pad for romney

You were prescient on that one. I think this issue is probably now more put to bed than 47% after Ryan's admittedly strong response. Speaking of...where is the 47% reference? Supposedly Obama wants to use it tonight.

First time in all debates that i feel that obama has made a swing left on Guns. Not too sure the Assault Weapons Ban being effective. Assault Weapons and Machine Guns are not the same.

True, but still a pretty half-assed takedown of gun control. Nobody's actually serious about it. Also...where is Romney going with this??

Trying to avoid the question like the plague.

Romney now reaching DEEP into the right-wing conspiracy pool. Uh...what?

God and I thought all the fuel had already burned off. But no there's a second explosion on the pad.

Lol. Yeah, Romney blaming womens for gun violence and then pivoting to something no one outside the right cares about.

Side note: Somewhere, John Kerry winces as Obama says "for it before he was against it."

indeed

Trickle Down Government. I think mitt should stay away from trickle down anything.

Stephen Harper FTW!

Haha. Chuck's digging the Canada reference right now.

Romney is kinda swimming around now. I feel like he should have stuck with the "lower taxes on business" argument. For me that was most convincing part of that speech. The rest was...kind of incoherent, which I feel like has been rare for Romney, even tonight.

Yes since were just a few minutes away from the end here, I am gonna say Romney came out strong, though not as strong as last debate, but the president has really come back in the second half. I know its cliche but i would probably call this a tie (leaning obama).

True Mr President, I dont think you could find any american who wants to work in a Foxconn factory.

I totally, totally disagree with everything Obama ever says on outsourcing though. As a person who took an economics class, I know that the key is to evolve our economy, have better education, and invent new industries, not to artificially increase competitiveness.

Romney was way better on that in terms of the real world. But Obama is doing a better job now.

This question feels like the setup for 47%. And Romney sounds really anguished.

Called it.

It had to come sometime.

Where are you thinking in terms of win loss

PBS is saying that the president won hands down. Some comeuppance for big bird?

Also Good point from PBS, The president really didnt outline how his second term would be different from the first.

I respect you for sticking by your guy. But I agree with PBS - he got shellacked tonight - not as badly as Obama did the first time out, but still bad. To paraphrase someone on Twitter - Romney never recovered after the Benghazi sequence.

Agree that Romney came out stronger. But as you said, by the end he was blowing up on the launch pad.

From twitter: Paul says the 47% final remark was strong.

Also, FOX News agrees with me, because they called it a draw.

Your Right. Looking at the damage that Obama did with that final point I concede victory. Also I am very much still undecided, going into tonight i was leaning heavily towards Romney and I still am but the president certainly made up for the last debate tonight. For a bit of a comic break, I am undecided but I don't think i am one of these people.

Well thats helpful

Chuck! Great, great conversation we had during the debate as always. I'm sure you have some final comments to throw in.

After those, I'd like your thoughts on using Branch to do this discussion, since it's a new platform and could probably benefit from feedback.

My comments: it was great for this kind of discussion. We had good back and forth. Comment length is about right. Embeds and live features very cool (a few glitches/slowdowns here and there).

Some negatives: Auto-share on Twitter is pretty underdone. Too much filler, not enough of the response, and it includes my user by default, spammy. Live-updating a bit glitchy/slow. No sense of if anyone is tuning in. Hard to go back and forth between Branch and Twitter.

Note: it might be hard for me to go back and forth between twitter and branch because I'm not good at it. But it would be cool to see some kind of backchannel (browser ext?) some day in the distant future.

Well as for final comments, don't have any thing to add other than what i said earlier. That said, I reserve the right to come back tomorrow with a little followup.

As for branch, I was skeptical at first but this is a pretty great idea. I just wish the twitter integration was a little better. It would be nice to integrate hash-tags directly into each post to bring the branch into the greater discussion that was going on.

But that's it for me, Luckily I do have a job, it doesn't require my degree and forces me up at obscene hours of the morning but its better than most. See you all next week.

Bye Chuck and thanks again! I'll close the Branch on, say, Friday so you have time to add some comments?

(hey folks, new idea: scheduled closing times for Branches)